Just crashed... dam you sticking throttle!


(system) #61

So what’s the damage?


(system) #62

Quoted 1200 for the suspension parts and front plastic bumper… He did say something about paint, though unless chassis related, I’m not sure… Labour on top plus all of the recovery costs.


(mender) #63

I did ths immediately and it was received by Roger, but I could not post to update as the thread was then closed.


(mender) #64

No joy with Renault then?


(system) #65

Renault now have the video evidence and have yet to reply to that… You can watch the video on YouTube under Twizy sticking throttle or my rogernews tag. The report states that their tests with a variety of pedal positions and application of the brake always disconnected the power and they couldn’t replicate the stuck-on condition I experienced.


(mender) #66

//youtu.be/1Nh4n7stDLo

There is the link to my original video and my explanatory text to explain the content:
This video shows a Renault Twizy throttle sticking slightly after a near miss accident when driven from cold on a freezing day. Within 100 metres of first pressing the pedal, my foot was taken off but the pedal to slow down, but it did not spring back upwards, nearly causing an accident. This video shows the pedal an hour later when the outside temperature had risen and after the pedal had been pumped quickly and repeatedly in order to be able to move the car out of danger. It is by then only slightly sticking* but does illustrate that there is a fault with the throttle assembly in cold conditions-which cannot be replicated in a warm Renault workshop.
*My belief is that the return spring is coated in grease that hardens in very cold conditions making the spring stiff and this can be overcome as the grease warms in warmer conditions or from the heat generated by pumping the pedal. Once warm, the fault does not occur, but there is an urgent need for Renault to take control of the matter. I had a very near miss and know of one forum member who has crashed due to this fault, but after testing, Renault state they cannot replicate the fault-even though they have issues a Red OTS recall for sticking throttles on early models.


(Lightly) #67

My Throttle behaves exactly like that ,but sometimes I can let the car drive itself for as much as 30 seconds, Despite the Twizy being low powered, at the wrong moment this sticking can be very unnerving at best, and it easy to imagine an accident from it.That video would be enough for a multi million pound law suit in America.
It only a matter of time before something even worse happens than a bent lamppost.


(mender) #68

As said, it was much worse than the momentary sticking you see on the video-this was shot later in a warmer temperature, after the throttle had been thoroughly pumped in order to move the Twizy and re-park it. It would stick down for 20+ seconds before I thought to video it-I only did it to show the unbelieving dealers where it was being recovered too.

If I was in Roger’s position, I would be most certainly getting them to repair the car and offer me some goodwill for the experience and loss of use. There would be no way that my insurance company would be getting involved whatsoever. As said like a sticking needle in a record, they recalled/issued a red OTS notice for sticking throttles but deny that the throttles stick-it is not rocket science to pursue this. It must have happened in other countries too where the weather is colder than here in winter, but I am not spending more time researching this now*

Roger can get it repaired by the insurers and the next person who it happens to somewhere in Europe can pursue it effectively and set a precedent.
Lets hope that no-one is injured before this happens-or that the residual value is annihilated because it is being handled badly by Renault who could contact all owners, view the evidence, do a cold test (it IS cold enough outside!) and fit an alternative pedal.

*It may appear that as I am no longer an owner, having sold my Twizy that I am now trying to be negative about it-this is not the case at all, I just feel for those that are getting a bad deal because they are not familiar with using due process to get the result they need. As I work in the motor trade and have had personal experience in dealing with unfit cars of my own, I have been through it and have just been trying to help-but I had the thread locked after hinting that I was doing this to help but had priorities time/money-wise which precluded making a CD copy and posting it. Even after this I followed the posts and sent it via wetransfer-but had no thanks for sorting the video out, then it was posted on youtube (first I knew of it was on this thread) without the accompanying text which I had sent with it and asked to be included if it was to be used was not added.

In context, I bought mine cheap as an ex-demo after brutal haggling and sold it through here to Les and Jen who wanted the spec and colour mine; so I enjoyed the five months of ownership for peanuts-the bits that I had with it that did not involve Renault or their dealers.
Mine was not an impulse purchase as I was worried about resale values before I agreed to buy one so haggled the loss out of the purchase price and the sale was probably a case of fortunate timing after my persistence to get my own Twizy fully sorted out by using the aforementioned due process with Renault.

But…if I had paid list price and then watched sales/tech/recall issues unfolding that saw dealers start selling new ones for near half price (see £3995 post) and was left with a car that Renault did not want to take in as part-ex and denied any responsibility for any of the problems it had, I would have been extremely angry indeed and would have taken Renault down brutally and effectively via the media.

However, it is not my problem now and my intervention may be being taken as a negative thing now that I have sold mine, so I’ll concentrate on forums relevant to cars that I do now own and hope that this matter gets sorted out swiftly so you all enjoy your Twizys in they way they should be enjoyed :cool:


(system) #69

I havent experienced any poor treatment from dealers here in West London, and fortunatley my throttle responds perfectly so far. But looking at that video, if it happened to me , I would be heading straight back to Renault for a full investigation. Undrivable in my opinion.


(Normsthename) #70

if it happened to me , I would be heading straight back to Renault for a full investigation. Undrivable in my opinion.

+1
I would / Will be back to the dealer in a shot!
And I won’t take no for an answer…

Andy


(system) #71

I’m sorry Mender that you didn’t feel thanked or appreciated by offering your video. I too had the post blocked until yesterday. As you know, due to the quality of the video, I could not send it to Renault without repeating the transfer process. You also said that you didn’t have a youtube account to publish it. I can only appologise if that wasn’t what you intended. I wasn’t aware that you wanted me to use your words directly on the video post but I am happy for you to add your text. The video link has been sent to Renault customer support who are dealing with my safety call. They have also been given the link to this forum and this thread. I also believe that Auto Express are to run a watchdog article in the near future, perhaps as close as next week… They came to take photographs last Saturday. I have stated to Renault Customer Care that I need them to confirm that they conducted the test in exactly the same conditions as you and I experienced (and I believe TwizyWindows is on his third pedal). That if Renault didn’t put the throttle in an outside, freezing and then thawing condition, with high humidity and for an overnight time period, then it wouldn’t have the same problem. Renault have yet to confirm this. I have been without a car now for nearly 4 weeks so believe me, I am doing all I can to resolve the problem from within my capabilities, using your video and the forum to get this issue into the public domain. I am not here to attack Renault. However, this is an issue I experienced… I didn’t crash because I lost control of my Twizy; Renault believe that they have tested the component. My insurer believe that from the report that Renault issued, the test results were enough to authorise my repair, even though I sent them a copy of the video too… So in that respect I get my car repaired at the expense of my future insurance quotes however, I haven’t had my initial querey sufficently answered or confirmed to change my opinion of the fault. We are now stuck in the bank holiday sequence so it will be next week before any extra developments take place. It is still my intent to get the assurance I seek for my safety when driving the car next winter as the problem will go when the weather is warmer.


(mender) #72

Thanks Roger, hope you get it sorted.
You must have more patience/reserve than me in dealing with Renault!

Good luck


(system) #73

Thought you might want to read the response after the video was sent… Still dispute my version as they believe that any brake pedal engagement would disconnect power. They have not answered my question about the temp of the test or the ambient moisture. The Friday they tested the car was a mild dry day… That is the next angle I will pursue.

ROGER

Subject: Renault Twizy, WV62NBN – Alleged throttle failure
Our reference: 1-187602640
Dear Mr Newsham,*
Thanks you for your furtheremails since my lastcomminicationto you.I can confirm the vehicle was already in the Toomey workshop when our technician arrived at the dealership. The vehicle was not tested on a Dyno, rather our technician went out with the car to try to re-create the fault.After discussing this matter internally and reviewing theinformation available to uswe concludedthe accidentcould not have been caused due to throttle sticking as nomanufacturing defect wasidentifiedor re-created.We can also confirm when simulated if youexperienced the throttle sticking then byapplying pressureto*the brake as you have alleged then the vehicle would still come to a stop.From the evidence viewed and your events of the incident it has been concluded that Renault cannot accept liability for the accident you have experienced.**I appreciate that this is not the answer that you were hoping for but I hope that this email clarifies our position. Should you have any further queries please feel free to contact me on our Customer Relations number0844 335 00 00.*Yours sincerely


(osbrook) #74

Not convinced I could stop my Twizy by pressing the brakes while the motor is being driven. The brakes are good but it takes a lot more pressure. If it cut the power then fine it would work but it doesn’t.


(system) #75

While the sticking throttle is something which needs attention, I can confirm I can stop my Twizy with my right foot firmly planted on the accelerator, and my left on the brake pedal.

Another way to solve the problem of course, is to press the neutral switch and then firmly brake. That should bring the car to a safe stop :slight_smile:

Nikki.


(osbrook) #76

Does your dash show the power being cut when you press the brake pedal and accelerator? There are some people saying it does. My doesn’t.


(Bassflex) #77

Having been following this thread, and not had issue with the sticking throttle I thought I would just add my little test.

It states that putting your foor on the brake cuts power to the engine, but I dnot think it the case.

When we had snow again about 2 weeks ago, my drive was like an ice rink. I then thought of Back to the future when the doc is reving up the car to hit 88 mph (if only) and thought I would try the same.

With both feet on both pedals hard the car will not move. The moment you take pressure off of the brakes but not off the rear wheels start spinning.

I had no men in lab coats stand nearby to collect actual data, but it does make me wonder if the only reason the car does not move with both pressed hard is because the wheels cannot move, not because the engine is cut off, the moment the pressure is slightly off it will move, in ice it more obvious than on tarmac.


(system) #78

I’m in auto express this week guys… Can’t find it on the website…


(Jeffinergiraffe) #79

Hello Roger, just bought Auto Express page 26! Well done for getting this out in the public domain. Let’s see if Renault sit up and take notice. We are all behind you.


(system) #80

After two months of waiting, I may get my Twizy back next week - I had to ring them up as they had promised to ring me. Chap told me that they were waiting on a tyre from Renault / Continental and a window… I was puzzled at the window as I had made my own? HE said that Renault only did a plastic flexible window - as mine was rigid they were trying to source one… Err - not sure how to answer or follow that up. Perhaps they will purchase an after market? Anyway, with a bank holiday weekend, I doubt that it will be done for tuesday.